Re~Stirred Forum

residential child care officers have not been paid allowences for weekend work and
unsocial hours. these wages have been owed for four years.
now after agreeing they owe the wages b.c.c are trying to pay a token payment.
it was bad enough when councilor rudge was quoted in the guardian, saying he didnt
know when workers would receive equal pay claims payments but if theydeleyed long enough
the people may still not be around to collect them then added joke
what a way to treat staff b,c.c are acting like bandits they need to stand and deliver
now x sally123

thankyou for your welcome.
my topic maybe old news , i didnt realise realise until recently though how ruthless my ex-employers were.
they {b.c.c} were willing to face more legal costs than pay wages owed. also- another childrens home in
moseley {mulberry house) is about to close -after b.c.c. spent over £16,000 on updating staff training re-
working with under 14 year old service users. most of the staff are so demoralised they will be taking voluntary
redundency. what a complete waste of money. imagine £16,000 tax payers money gone and
more people out of work ---.sally123.

It's pretty easy to bring an employment tribunal claim for non-payment of wages. Are you in a union?

The concierge & security service in the Housing department have had a long standing battle about shift allowances. This resulted in a tribunal for “Unlawful deduction of wages” the tribunal took 18 months to get to court, & lasted two days in 2010. The tribunal was all going very well & the unions had a barrister supplied by Thompson’s solicitors. The results of the tribunal was that there had been a local agreement in place & there was no grounds to appeal. Result = no pay or change A deal probably done on a golf course.

Concierge work five days a week rotating shifts covering 07:00-19:00

Security work twelve hour shifts at night 19:00- 07:00 & cover weekends, bank holidays.
When the new contract came in November 2011 the security got some shift allowance backdated to Nov 2011.

BCC will spend plenty of money on solicitors to get them out of paying their employees fairley..

At the moment the equal pay settlements have been paid to claimants whom used Stefan Cross & other no win no fee lawyers. These payments were made at 75% of the claim.
Claimants that registered their claim with the unions that are supposedly recognised by BCC have just had letters from the union solicitors informing the claimants that BCC was prepared to offer union claimants considerably less than the other claimants. The union solicitors told BCC that they was aware of this & it was unacceptable. The Council then refused to go to the meeting booked for 23 Jan saying they needed more time to consider their options. The next meeting is booked for the 27th February.

A direct attack for been a union member & a opptunity to discredit the unions.

This may result in another expensive court case for BCC.

If there is a local agreement your argument is with your union, not BCC.

Not according to the tribunal. As there was no mention of shift allowance in the 1992 contract it was not payable. Concierge then worked various shifts covering 24 hrs & bank holidays, however other departments paid it.
The tribunal suggested that we would have more success with an equal pay claim. which we & many others have been. This is because there has never been any consistency of allowances paid by BCC. That is why they are now along with other councils in the position they are in, BCC are now to mortgage, borrow, and sell its assets to pay their liabilities to staff.

http://www.communities.gov.uk/news/localgovernment/2063709

Mysteriously some senior officers involved in the tribunal giving evidence for BCC found themselves out of work.

thankyou for your replies .re -concierge staff you have my support , re-was clifford comment that my argument is with the union ,
i beg to differ, my shifts when working in a residential childrens home were as follows 7am-3pm- next day 2-30-10pm- next day 7am-3pm next day- 3-30pm-11pm sleep in duty thats if we managed to get off the "floor" at 11pm . we started work the following morning at 7am finishing at midday (all being well) . my point being these shifts ran concurrent -weekends ,bank hols, easter ,xmas
if that was your shift then you worked it . my contract with b.c.c. stated " if you work weekends as part of a normal working week
then time and a half will be paid for saturdays and double pay for sundays. also an allowence for unsocial hours worked after 8pm
to 10pm (11pm on a sleeping in duty)
this was the 2007 contract ----we have not received any of the allowences to date!
b.c.c. are in breach of contract , they are with holding our wages , not the union. my fight is with b.c.c, with the help of my g.m b union. tell me would,nt you fight for what should be your very hard earned wage? especially working in a job that nas a strained work/ life balance.
what about Councilor Rudge,s crass remark i mentioned in my first posting -----sally123

Those shifts are appalling. In the back of the book that we was all issued with our new contract of employment following the implementation of single status 2007 there is a supplementary section
The section covers additional allowances.
I am also in the GMB & although we lost our case if you speak to your rep & ask him to contact the full time union officials that work for housing at the Birmingham Forward branch they may be able to pass on some advice if you need to go to tribunal.
If it’s any help part of our case was that BCC did not pay us anything towards cleaning of the uniform that they supplied. another unlawful deduction of wages. This is also listed in the contract book. We won this case
If you haven’t already done so speak to your rep & complete an equal pay claim. There is a time limit so act fast.

http://www.gmb-westmids.org.uk/id94.html

thanks charlie, i have filled in eqal pay claim it,s lodged with thompsons solicitors, due to the 6 year rule it will go back to
2005 . as i didnt claim till nov 2011. again b,c,c, plays games with their employee,s, by cancelling what should have been
a settlement meeting on 23/1/12 . i heard that central government had already given b.c.c money for equal pay claims a while ago
anyway they can use the interest they gained from not paying wages to settle all claims.
just for the record re- bin men and muscles needed for their job. we at times had to restrain troubled young teenagers ,also whilst
caring for service users us "resi" workers were at times spat on, punched ,kicked . called every foul name imaginable, yet we stayed and mostly were successful in turning the young persons life around , we eased their pain. b.c.c. knew we wouldn,t - couldn.t strike for equality
when the refuse workers went on strike ,bin bags were left , where would we leave the kids in our care? next to the bin bags!
pay and grading was/ is unequal . b.c.c. forced it on workers so now have to redress the balance and pay what is owed all we want
is for b.c.c. to act as if they are decent employers i dont begrudge the refuse workers their bonuses ,i simply want the same bonuses for doing my job which at times was very unpleasent .. think about carers who do personal care ? they give dignity to their service users i will stop now/ thanks to all ----sally123

RE-Refuse workers and times they now have to collect house hold rubbish, complain to B.C.C
shortage of equipment, staff shortages ,heavier work loads ,less pay = B,C,C emoloyee. who also
pay council tax . services will all soon be provided by private suppliers , releasing B,C,C from being
sole suppliers and sole responsibility of services meaning you will get what you pay for - er if you are able
to pay that is sally 123

still waiting for news of when B.C.C will pay what they agree they owe , also now allowences have been t aken away in the contract
forced on B.C.C employees nov 201
, i predict trouble covering shifts for weekend nightwake officers who will be payed "plain time"

just a quick update, to my knowledge, staff are still awaiting for allowences/wages. Also tomorrow 27th feb is the next meeting
between B.C.C.-Thompsons solicitors and unions , re- equal pay settlenments, last monh B.C.C. pulled out of the meeting (20th Jan)
B,C,C, tried to get the unions to agree to a lower figure (re-settlement) to what was agreed and paid to Stefan Cross-clients.
i hope B.C.C. stop their shenanigans, and simply act responsibly by settling what is owed at tomorrows meeting

wonder when we know the outcome of todays meeting ? re-equal pay meeting . anyone got any news

Have just received a letter from the Union solicitors. The meeting went ahead 27/02/2012.
This relates to the first case pre single status. (Claims pre 2008) Anyone on these claims would have regsisted their claim with the tribunal in 2010. Steffan cross agreed these claims in December 2011. They went back four years & accepted 75% of the claim.
Unbelievably the Council wished to carry on discussing the less favourable settlement proposals they had put forward previously. They were told that they needed to put forward better settlement proposals. Frustratingly the Council said that they were not in a position to consider putting forward new proposals because their finance officer was on annual leave. For this reason it was not possible to conclude a settlement.

Considering the importance of this meeting, why was there no one from the Council with any authority?
The reasons BCC are making these payments are down to them treating employees unequally, yet they appear to be treating trade union members unequal. (Opening up another court case.)

The letter goes on to say that when they are able to discuss the matter further with their finance officer they will be able to put forward new proposals. A further meeting has been arranged for the 14th March the Council assured the unions that they shared the aim of resolving the claims without further employment tribunal litigation. The alternative would be to carry on with the process which could take at least another two years.
The second claim relates to post 2008, where certain groups of employees had their pay increased on the job evaluation to mitigate their loses on the withdrawal of bonuses. Anyone who has recently resisted their claims would be for claim 2.
Both Steffan Cross & Thompsons are currently working on this.

In my opinion BCC ar stalling so any payouts come out of next financial year’s budget & will reflect on the new Labour Council & not the current coalition.

Councillor Rudge joked in an interview , about when B.C.C. staff would receive equal pay awards, Cllr Rudge said "could be ages,they might never see it, depends how long hey live" (said to Simon Hatterstone of the Guardian news paper 1/5/10)
Jan 23/1/12 meeting with unions ,Thompsons Solicitors -cancelled. B.C.C were offering less than what has been paid to Stefan Cross soliciors clients.( B.C.C refused to attend the meeting after their plans were discovered shortly before that meeting)
Next meeting arranged 27/2/12 . same game plan by B.C.C only this time the negotiations re-a further offer to make a settlement couldnt go ahead due to the finance officer being on annual leave another meeing arranged for 14/3/12
if this one fails ,Thompsons solicitors have warned if no settlements are agreed 14/3/12 employment tribunal process would take a further 2 years
so theres only one finance officer who could attend ? B.C.C must have known the officer would be on holiday . Give us strength some very fed up staff working for B.C.C. today

Threads Merged - Sally please don't start new threads when you already have one on the same Subject

the councill being in breach of conract re- allowences , is i thought a different thread to - equal pay-single status disputes. allowences are wages not paid since the new contract was forced on us 2007 , then removed altogether nov 2011 . also i was sickened at Cllr Rudge's crass innapropriate joke , for which he has never apologised , my colleague passed away 2 years ago =B.C.C have saved some money there haven't they

still no word on allowences, wish someone could tell us what B,C,C, are doing? they agree they owe the allowences, please tell me we dont have to resort to lengthy court proceedings.
we need a champion to sort all this fairly-from B.C.C. side i mean

sorry to harp on but someone told me today B.C.C are asking for figures re-calculations for allowences owed?
please tell me how people recently made redundant can access "rota's from 2007 " up to -oct- 31- 2011
hope that "H.R" are ready to man the phones , people will be wanting some answers
why cant B.C.C simply advise the unions as to whats happening, the unions could then advise us minions

any news anyone?" tumble weed connecton"
end of tax year is "nigh" wish someone who is a b.c.c employee could end the speculaton for recently retired colleagues

As the end of the financial year approaches, it seems that BCC are suddenly agreeing to release people that were previously not released to go on VR. Having waited months with no news, emails are landing telling people that they must go by the end of the month. Three weeks notice notice isn't enough if you need to consider alternative employment.

I am not suprised by the lack of concern shown by B.C.C. towards their staff, their number one priority has always been what suits
B.C.C. first, when they told staff, that Stuarts Road childrens home was going to close, staff were told not to tell the young people,
as a senior manager would talk to them nearer the time. Badly managed , it took the "kids" 24hrs to find out, -from a young person in another home!. The staff were then left with the fall out, the "kids" felt betrayed.
The answer i feel staff will be given, re-leaving date for "v.r" being suddenly decided by B.C.C. (and not mutually agreed which is supposed to happen )will be "you requested "v.r"
maybe we might hear about the wages (allowences) owed .Also be interesting to see what shenanigans B.C.C. will pull this coming wed's -14th, at another equal pay settlement meeting , hope the finance officer had a good holiday and is ready to talk sensibly.

Well tomorrow is the big day, for a possible equal pay settlement agreement
who will be first to post the outcome here? come on B.C.C. do the right thing, after all you have paid Stefan Cross's clients

Anyone heard if the meeting happened, any outcomes?

The financial officer didn't show up !

not again! i have just passed on your post Mr Bridger , people will be so fed up . what faith can anyone have in the B.C.C.

Thompsons will have to show they mean business as BCC have no intention of entering into meaningful negotiations and never have. Attempts have been made to negotiate a settlement less than the 100% entitlement to show good faith and to save the taxpayer money but BCC continually act with no honour by either not turning up or by making derisory offers. This will probably end up at tribunal costing the taxpayer substantially more and BCC will be bleating that it was unavoidable, if they settle now a substantial amount will be avoidable. Forget whose watch this has happened on and the political blame game, it is something that one solicitor called Stefan Cross who has bought this to the forefront after being left in an equality wilderness for many years. Whether you think he is just in it for the cash or if he just want to put a wrong right, he has more guts and determination than any union or their feeble employment law solicitors and has so far achieved the best deal in negotiations for his clients. Now Thompsons need to show their teeth and secure a chunk of the £200m that the government has allowed councils to borrow to fund equal pay claims.

you wont see any arguments from me , with what you say ,my colleagues and myself have echoed what you have posted. so is it another two years or is there yet another meeting? . the unions have been very quiet about these meetings, it is our membership money that pays Thompsons, (and certain union officials money.) Also we haven't had any updates on when we will receive WAGES OWED =the allowences from 2007/8 are wages, and should have been in our wage monthly packet, when the contract in 2007 was forced on us. looks like the B.C.C. may be trying to use that £20 mill elsewhere. i hope a provision was inplace for the reason of the loan - i.e only loaned to settle equal pay claims

Just to make it clear BCC are one of the councils given the go ahead to sell or use assets to pay what is due to their employees both past and present. See article:- http://www.communities.gov.uk/news/corporate/2063620.

I don't know if a date has been set since Tuesday, I do know that the unions have strongly recommended that Thompsons stop being so diplomatic and push this on to tribunal. I think there is enough to show that BCC have been less than willing to enter into meaningful negotiations.